Christina: [00:00:00] Welcome to the taking the lead podcast, where we empower people to be unstoppable. I'm Christina Hapner with my cohost, Leslie Haskins and Timothy Cuneo. All right. I have to start by talking about this because I had a meeting this morning and we were talking about trending topics and that sort of stuff.
And there were some words that are trending that I didn't even know existed. I think. Getting too old, but, um, I thought I was hip and trendy, but like in the meeting they were like Yeet and I was like, what is a Yeet? And I'm probably saying it wrong,
Leslie: but I mean, so wait, did you get a definition? What does eat mean?
I don't know. And I hope is this even appropriate to say no. No.
Christina: And then like, these are like Gucci, which means, I guess. Good and cool. And
Leslie: like, I was like, what is happening?
Christina: I don't know. Do you guys have you guys heard these words before?
Leslie: I don't know, but I feel like we should have looked them up before when[00:01:00]
Timothy: may broke some FCC rules here. We don't know. Oh,
Leslie: I can't believe that I've heard those two, but one I keep hearing, which apparently defines me is that two gay, which is, I guess like millennials trying to still be cool, which is me. Um, so I guess you would call me cheeky, but that's the only word I know.
And I don't think it's supposed to be a nice term, however, I'm leaning into it. Yeah.
Christina: I, I just was shocked this morning. I just had to talk this out because I didn't know if you guys had heard any of these words before, but I was like, I'm not that old. I at least I didn't think I
Leslie: was that old Timothy.
What have you learned anything new lately?
Timothy: Oh, I just learned how w S M H meant. And that was just like a couple of weeks ago. So I'm really behind on this abbreviation
Leslie: stuff. What does SMH mean? Shake
Timothy: my head. Everybody's [00:02:00] shaking her head right now going, oh my God. He's old. So, uh, Gucci, I mean, I've heard of a Gucci, but.
Leslie: Yeah, I guess it means it's
Christina: like super cool, because I think,
Leslie: I mean is probably not cool to say like Gucci, you know,
Christina: I can't keep
up.
Leslie: I can't keep up. You know what? I will be honest. So I, the most times that I get updated on these types of things are during camp, the week of camp, when we have 16 and 17 year olds on campus and you hear their language and they just, you know, Throw it in there it's common terms and then you ask them about it.
And that's when I think people would probably say I'm too gaze, because then I'm now asking kids what the terms mean. And we been had the camp in two years, at least in-person camp. So yeah, no, I'm very behind. If anyone
Christina: ever called me that, I would just say thank you. Because I would think it was like cool, but apparently
Leslie: it's mom.
So we should take it at school because that's what we are. Right. It's just trying to make.
Timothy: I
Christina: try. I try
Leslie: it. [00:03:00] All right. Well, if anybody knows any cool terms, uh, feel free to send them our way. So Christina Timothy, and I can stay up to date with things, I guess. Cause it turns out we are behind a good thing.
We do know about leader, dog and, and blindness. So at least we can talk about those things. So on today's episode, we have a very special guest who has attended all three of the leader, dog program. And has been a featured client for numerous leader, dog events, and as a huge inspiration to many, she and
Christina: in Coloma has retinitis pigmentosa.
And she grew up in sturgeon bay, Wisconsin on her parents' dairy farm, where she spent most of her childhood playing outdoors in may of 2020 Shannon graduated from the university of Wisconsin Stevens point with her bachelor of science in environmental education and interpretation. She's currently serving her second AmeriCorps term as an environmental educator at a local nature center in lacrosse, Wisconsin, and an effort to make the [00:04:00] outdoor more inclusive to people with disabilities, particularly those who are blind or visually impaired.
She then created the website, the blind naturalists, where she currently shares her experiences, navigating nature and vision loss on her.
Timothy: Hello, Shannon and welcome to the program. And we're happy to just your hair. What age was your vision changing that you noticed?
Shannon: Yeah, thank you for having me. I am thrilled to be on the, taking the lead podcast and I was diagnosed with retinitis pigmentosa.
When I was two, my parents kind of had a feeling. Something was, was different because when I started walking, I would trip over our two big black labs. Um, I would re when I would be running in the living room, I would run into the vacuum cleaner and whenever I wanted to see something, uh, I always had to bring it to a window to see it in the natural light.
So my. Mom. And I would go to doctor after doctor, and finally they diagnosed me with retinitis pigmentosa at the age of two and growing up, I didn't [00:05:00] really. So growing up, I spent a lot of time outdoors and really the only challenges I faced was I couldn't play at night. Um, I couldn't see at night, so I would, you know, just, that was my biggest challenge.
Um, but when I started attending school, a lot of other challenges started to. You know, I started to, when I started to attend school, there were more challenges that I faced. So I wasn't able to, um, see the whiteboard or the chalkboard. I had difficulty seeing my textbooks and, uh, the worksheets that I had.
So, um, I wouldn't really say that my vision. Really started to affect me when I was maybe five or six. Um, because I was seeing all these other kids who were, you know, able to read books and able to, um, work on their worksheets and read the chalkboard from back behind the. [00:06:00] We're able to read the chalkboard from the back of the room while I had to be super duper close to it.
So, yeah, that's when I really started noticing my vision and throughout the years, uh, my vision has, uh,
Leslie: decreased. So you were diagnosed at age two, which is really young. It's amazing that your parents were really catching on to those different things and started to notice like, Hey, something might not be right here.
Um, so did you receive any type of services or start using a cane at such a young age or was that kind of later on in school when it really started to impact your life?
Shannon: So I would say later on in school, um, I was able to see a vision teacher every month, um, as well as an orientation and mobility instructor.
And, um, I started using a white cane, I want to say maybe in second grade and I hated it. Yeah, it is my white cane so much, so much so that my, um, orientation and mobility instructor had to pay me a dollar and[00:07:00]
he saw me. Um, but he was really persistent. And I remember one way that he made a white cane training. Fun for me was, um, we named all of my school hallways after SpongeBob square pants characters. So I could know, I could know the Cardinal directions, you know, so we would go to different, um, uh, hallways and he'd be like, okay, what hallway are we in?
And what are the cartel directions? And I'd be like Patrick Starr hallway, which goes north and south. Um, so that really helps me with my Cardinal directions and it started to make white kids. Training more fun. Um, and through elementary school, middle school and high school, I got white cane training, but it was, it was very limited.
Um, again, I only got it once a month during the school year and it wasn't until I went to leader dogs, white cane. Training that I got more experience in different environments. I can't
Christina: imagine as a kid not [00:08:00] wanting to, you know, go through that. Cause I mean, as a kid, I was stubborn myself, so I totally understand that.
And it sounds like your instructor made it a lot of fun and growing up in school, were you the only kid or did you know any other kids with vision impairment?
Shannon: I didn't know any other kids until I went to, uh, my first camp for the blind, which was at the Wisconsin school for the blind and visually impaired.
And that was the first time that I had met, um, People who were, or children, my age that had visual impairments or who were blind, um, growing up in a rural community. I was the only kid in my school district that had a visual impairment. I
Leslie: want to go back to your orientation, mobility specialists, who sounds amazing.
You know, one thing on this podcast, we've talked a lot about orientation mobility with adults, which is so different than teaching kids. And I just love the way you were describing what your instructor was doing, because. Oh, and who teach children really do have to be so [00:09:00] creative in the ways that they encourage white cane training.
Cause as you were saying, you were zero interested. Didn't want to do it. It made you different. It made you stand out. Um, which as a child is really hard to do and except. I think that's really cool. Another thing that OEMs for kids also have to do is really teach a lot of concepts that, um, a lot of times adults don't or have already kind of established later in life when they come to leader dogs.
So just a shout out to all those, uh, O and M's out there that are working with kids and, and putting in all those hours and trying to make it a fun and exciting experience. So, uh, it sounds like you had a really good one.
Shannon: I did.
Timothy: So I had a, some bay from Sturgis, Wisconsin find leader, dog. How did you find leader
Shannon: dog?
Yeah, so it was in high school that one of my special education teachers, um, introduced me to leader dog. She showed me a flyer for the summer experience camp and there was no way I was not going to. Um, fly to [00:10:00] Michigan all by myself and be stuck at a place
you know, so I was very reluctant and, um, so. You know, I wasn't budging. And that same teacher introduced me to two very special women in my community, a puppy raiser and a leader, dog user. So she brought in Maggie who raised 30 liter dogs and she brought her. The future leader dog at the time Kindle. And you know, that puppy kind of sold me.
She told me what she did as a puppy raiser and what leader dog does for people who are blind and visually impaired. And that kind of helped, but it wasn't until I met Patty and her leader, dog Lilly, where I was officially sold. Um, Patty had come to my school and we were talking about how Lily changed her life and her life with [00:11:00] vision loss and.
Uh, towards the end of her visit, we were just walking around the hallways of my school and I had my cane, she had Lily and she's like, Shannon, put away your cane. I'd like you to take Lily for a spin. And so I fold up my cane and grabbed a hold of Lily's harness and I told Lily forward, and that moment right there, I was like, I am getting a leader, dog.
This is what I need to do to, you know, for my future. Um, for once, you know, I felt free and I felt like I could put trust into this. This dog is. So after that I went home and I filled out an application. And a few months later I flew out to two liters. That
Leslie: is such a great story. She hadn't Christina and I are over here, like, oh my God, that's so great.
Like I D I think it, you know, it really shows that mentors are so important in our lives. And like how that little [00:12:00] experience that she provided for you was so impactful and kind of set you on this journey forward. Um, so that's incredible. And I'm so glad that you filled out that application and got on the plane and came to leader dog for summer experience camp.
All the other programs. Um, but do you mind telling us about camp a little bit, like kind of your favorite part.
Shannon: Really, that was one of the best weeks of my life. I think it was amazing to even just connect with, you know, teenagers 16 and 17 year olds, just like me from all around the country that had, um, blindness or visual impairments.
Um, because at my other camps that I had gone to, you know, Kids of all different ages. Um, but at this camp I was able to be with people like me, my age that had, you know, my, my same challenges and we did so many fun things. You know, sometimes we had white cane training, um, downtown and other times we did zip lining and rock climbing and we did tandem biking.
Um, and I [00:13:00] would say, you know, I think. Most favorite day, like many campers is dog day, where we get to where we got to, um, work with a guide dog and a guide dog mobility instructor. So, yeah, that was definitely my favorite. And I think, you know, overall, what I really took from that camp was just making those connections with, um, people at leader, dog, um, you know, volunteers that had come and helped.
And, uh, just my fellow campers. I am still friends with a lot of them today and it's been wonderful just watching their own. Um, whether they, you know, go back to leader, dog four liter dog, or they, you know, go back for like cane training. It's been wonderful just to watch my friends, you know, grow up around, around the country alongside me.
Christina: So I think that's amazing that you were able to meet so many people around the country and. I've heard about summer experience camp. I have not worked at leader dog when it's happened. And so I'm excited to kind of [00:14:00] witness it because we're hoping to have it in person for the first time in a couple of years this year.
And you know, what was it like when you first got onto campus? You know, camp for any kid I know is, or any teenager is a little nerve wracking. Um, you know, you're meeting new people. You're, you're in a. Place that you've never been before. What was that like kind of that first day when you flew in? Yeah, I think I
Shannon: was definitely nervous.
It was my first time being on a plane all by myself, going to a new state all by myself, but, you know, um, leader dog did an incredible job with getting me connected with a volunteer who picked me up and drove me to leader dog. And I really had such a welcoming experience at first. Um, you know, A few other campers at the airport.
And in the, um, in the van driving down a leader dog, we were just chatting and, um, you know, the volunteer was chatting with us and when [00:15:00] we get to leader, dog, I mean, just everyone was so welcoming and friendly and warm. And I think that really helps the transition. You know, being in this new place, being with all these new people.
And, uh, I mean, I just remember, you know, there were, there were days too that we just didn't want to go to bed, but we just wanted to stay up and talk. And, uh, we really became a family within the first 24 hours. So it was really, um, wonderful, just how we were able to connect in all these different ways. Um, even though we came from all these different places.
Leslie: Absolutely. So for those listening, our campers are 16 and 17 years old from all over the U S and Canada. And they just, as Shannon is saying, get on a plane by themselves, they fly to Detroit. Um, and then we pick them up and baggage claim, our volunteers and our team members. So that alone, getting to the airport and getting on a plane by yourself at 16 or 17.
Two years old, many times it's their first flight. Um, so the [00:16:00] courage that that takes, I think is incredible and it speaks a lot about our campers. Um, and then coming to campus and Shannon is right. I absolutely love camp. So the first day everybody's a little shy and kind of to themselves. And then Shannon's exactly right after 24 hours, you would think these kids have known each other for a lifetime.
Just the connections that are made. So quickly, and it is so fun to watch everybody kind of come out of their shell and really be their own person and start feeling competent and secure, um, at the camp. And it's, it's just such a, such a cool transition. But, um, Shannon and I, so when Shannon came for camp, that was the first time that I met Shannon.
Cause I was at leader dog as an intern, uh, for the O and M program. And so Shannon and I experienced camp for the first time together and have so much fun and made a great connection as well. Um, but also I want to share a fun little story that I just told you the other day, which is so embarrassing on my part.
But, uh, so I met Shannon at camp first day, and then I was the lucky team member. Uh, when [00:17:00] the campers depart, we take them to the airport and then we walk through security. We sit with them at the gate. Um, until they board that plane, until that plane takes off, we don't leave just in case of anything. Um, so I was the lucky one to take Shannon to the gate and I watched her get on the plane.
I, she boarded and I there, I stood and I started sobbing uncontrollably. I am crying as I'm watching Shannon walk away. And the lady at the gate was like, oh my gosh, is that your sister?
which is so embarrassing and so funny, but it really does go to show like just how incredible these campers are and the connections that are made during that week. Because I, when Shannon said she was staying up all night, everybody was staying up all night. We were so tired. It was long days, but, um, just such a fun experience.
And I'm so glad that Shannon was able to come for that. And then Shannon, shortly after that, you came back, correct?
Shannon: Yeah, I couldn't, [00:18:00] uh, I couldn't stay
Christina: away.
Timothy: So all these activities that have at the summer camp, how impactful was it on your life at that time? I mean, they got the beat ball, they got the tandem biking.
What did that show you? What you're capable of doing even. Visually impaired
Shannon: for a lot of those activities. That was the first time I had ever done them. It was the first time I had ever tandem bikes. I had ever, um, zip lined. Um, I had never really even like, you know, been in a canoe too. We went to canoeing.
I remember one day and, um, it really showed me I can really do anything. Yeah, I, I was seeing all my other friends do the same things. So it made me realize, you know, we might have visual impairments, we might be blind, but we can really do anything. And we put our minds.
Christina: I love that. That is amazing. And I just want to point out because people listening to this are probably like, oh my gosh, that's got to cost an arm.
And they're like, well, this is completely [00:19:00] free for our clients. Thanks to all of them. Generous donors. So, you know, if you know someone who is blind or visually impaired, and they're hearing this and they're like, I want to come to summer camp, we fly you out. We feed you, we house you all of that. So I think that is very important to point out because I'm sure that there are some people out there going, wow, how much.
Costs right on the tandem bikes,
Leslie: so much fun. Um, so after camp, you came back for a week of orientation and mobility, um, and then you came back again, uh, for a guide dog. So do you want to tell us a little bit about your guide dog? Yeah,
Shannon: sure. I can talk a little bit about Frazier. Can I talk about white cane training though? Cause
Leslie: you know, you can always talk about what cane training
Shannon: that is such a big part of like, you know, my journey, um, that I just, I can't brush over it. I love that. Okay. [00:20:00] Um, so yeah, I would say I bought a month after camp. I flew back to, um, leader, dog and. Participated in a week long, a white cane training. And I was actually joined by one of my fellow campers too, which made that week so much more fun.
And plus you were there Leslie, as well as Jessica. And so that week was really impactful for me because. As I had said earlier, a lot of my white cane training was very limited and I only had experienced in my rural community. I had never crossed a lighted intersection. I had never traveled at night. It was my white cane is, so those are my two biggest goals with white cane training at leader dog.
And so throughout that week, we had so many different experiences. You know, we were able to have a night route and we were able to travel in different environments with our white cane. And I remember specifically to, um, Leslie and Jessica created a scavenger hunt that Ashley, the other participants and I had to do, [00:21:00] um, in downtown.
Chester Hills, um, where we had to go and ask for help at different businesses, because both Ashley and I did not like doing that. We did not like going down and asking for help asking for directions, but we had to do that. And I think that was when we got ice cream Lesley or something that was like the end of the scavenger hunt was we were getting ice cream.
Leslie: Let's see, wait, it wasn't so bad, right? It was terrible.
Timothy: Oh
Leslie: man. Shannon.
Shannon: And I think, you know, the most impactful thing, um, The last day when we did a blindfold walk, um, where I was put under blindfold and had to do a whole route under that blindfold. And I had to conquer my fear of crossing a lighted intersection. And this light light at the intersection was five lanes.
And I remember after I did that, [00:22:00] I felt on top of the world and I really started to appreciate my cane more for, um, what it allowed me to do. Um, so. Yeah. That week was really, um, an eyeopener for me. And it really helps me gain more confidence in just not only my white cane, but also my navigation skills, which later led me to, you know, get my guide.
Christina: I think that is amazing. And I think that just goes to show how amazing our orientation and mobility instructors are waking training instructors are to be able to come up with things like that. I mean, Leslie, that's amazing that you guys were able to come up with a little scavenger hunt and then also.
You out of your shell to ask questions and that sort of stuff. That's a great skill for anyone that a lot of people in general are afraid to speak up and ask for help and ask direction. So I just have to give a shout out to our amazing ONM team and Leslie, um, for all of the work they do, because it always blows my mind [00:23:00] when I hear from clients.
And I hear even just getting to watch our team, what they're able to do. I think.
Leslie: Amazing. Well, thank you, Christina. However, of course Shannon and Ashley, they we're the ones doing all the hard work. Um, but I'm so happy to hear Shannon that that was such an impactful a week for you. You know, we love what we do and we love seeing the growth and you have especially been fun for me to watch, uh, since.
We kind of joined the leader, dog family at the same time. So I've really enjoyed, uh, being part of your journey of course. And, um, and that led you to Frazier. So when did you come back to leader, dog for Frazier? I
Shannon: came back, um, in July of 2014. So it was the summer before my senior year of high school.
Leslie: Oh, what was that like having Frazier in high school?
Shannon: It was really wonderful. Um, my high school was pretty small. I graduated with a class of about 90, so I had really grown, grown up with these kids and they knew that I had a visual impairment. [00:24:00] So, um, the may, before I went to leader dog, we actually invited Maggie and Patty to talk with my. My entire high school, including the incoming freshmen.
And they talked about leader, dog etiquette, how to, um, you know, behave around, uh, a guide dog, a service dog. And that really helps with, um, everybody being on the same page and, um, It was a wonderful experience to just having Frasier, um, during that last year of high school, because we could really form a bond before we went off to college.
Um, so it was, it was great being able to be a team and kind of learn about each other and, um, have that time just to, you know, work with each other and figure out how to be a guide dog team. I love that
Christina: they educated your whole. High school. I mean, how many more people now? No, B that would have never known before.
A guy, dog and etiquette [00:25:00] and all of that. And now they're able to, you know, wherever they are now in the world are able to spread that mission and be advocates. So when they see another guy, dog or service dog around, they know what to do and they may be educating other people as well. I think that's amazing because you don't even know.
People that could impact on the line as well.
Leslie: Absolutely. Yeah. So not many high schoolers can handle a guide dog. Right? That's a huge responsibility. It takes a lot of maturity. It takes a lot of responsibility. And just what you're saying, it takes a lot of advocacy. So you really have to be able to advocate for yourself for your guide dog, your rights and things like that.
So to be able to do that at 17 years old and in. In a high school with other high school students, I think just shows how strong you are and courageous you are and, and what a good leader you are, which is really important. So then you and Frazier get to spend a year together, um, in your high school. And then you went off to college and so you and Frazier are still working together [00:26:00] beautifully.
Shannon: He just turned nine and the other day, I can't believe it. That is
Christina: crazy.
Shannon: Oh, my goodness. Yes. We graduated high school together. We graduated college together. We went to Europe. So, uh, my dad always says that dog's been more places than I have
Leslie: Shannon Frazier taken on the world. So I like it. Yes. So before we wrap up here, I'm just curious, Shannon, is there any words of advice or anything that you would want to tell anybody who's maybe a team and not sure what direction they're gonna go.
They're thinking guide dog, if there's thinking about camp, just any words of advice.
Shannon: Yeah. I would say definitely have an open mind. Um, it can definitely be scary to plane and go to a new place and be surrounded by all these new people. But, um, you know, Just give it a try. And if you have questions, don't hesitate to email or call leader, [00:27:00] dog because, um, everybody is so knowledgeable and friendly and can really get you on the right path.
You know, maybe camp is the right choice or isn't the right choice for you. But I really think that. Incredible way just to, you know, learn more about yourself, to connect with others and to just have a great time. So for parents who want to get their teams involved with leader, dog, I would say definitely encourage them.
And, um, you know, maybe you have to reach out to Lear dog or reach out to people in the community to get your, your teen and gets you connected with people in your community with leader, dog and, you know, get those answers. Um, or get those questions answered because that's how I was able to, you know, go to leader dog.
As I was able to meet people that were involved with leader dog and to showed me what leader dog can do. And, um, that really helped me cause I was in the comfort of my own home. I was in the comfort of my own school and, um, that really helped me with wanting to go to leader dog. [00:28:00]
Leslie: I think that's so great.
Shannon. That's one of the best ways that people get involved with leader. Dog is word of mouth and there's no better way to learn about leader dog than from somebody who's been here in some capacity or been involved with leader dog in some capacity. So I think that's excellent advice. Thank you so much.
Thank you so much for joining us today. Shannon. Thank you to our listeners for listening to taking the lead podcast. I'm Leslie Hoskins with host Timothy Cuneo and Christina happy. We really hope you enjoyed learning about Shannon's story. Join us next week as we continue to learn about Shannon and her ever changing journey with blindness.
Christina: Yes. And don't forget, you can reach us at taking the lead at leader, dog.org with any questions or ideas. And if you like today's podcast, make sure to hit subscribe and check us out. Wherever pop history. .